Ngage QD is the new Ngage

[ipodee]

http://ngage.gameaxis.com/articles/view.gax?id=270&gid=&pg=1

but no radio, mp3, and mono sound now

[cdover]

http://www.n-gage.com/en-R1/gamedeck/ngage_qd/

On the nokia site as well. :)

[Dynamoo]

I think we were all hoping for the "N-Gage 2" - but this ain't it. The screen size is still a bit pokey and loss of the MP3 player is a shame. A camera would be nice too.

It's a bit more of a stripped down games console than the original N-Gage. The funny naming arrangement makes me think that there might well be a range of N-Gage consoles, so the N-Gage 2 might still be in the wings.

It's not a band unit though.

Analysis here: http://www.mobilegazette.com/nokia-n-gage-qd.htm

[rohan123]

this phone sucks according to me
it doesnt have radio or mp3 player
its only smaller than the 1st one

the main thing is that it has a 4K screen

[ishaanranderia]

This is not the n-gage i was waiting for , what is nokia trying to do, why do they stick to old technologies. I would expect a gaming console to have the best stuff like a 262k screen a faster processor and the works, this is just the old n gage in a new body.

[Dynamoo]

As I said though, I don't think this is a replacement, it's more an "N-Gage Lite". My gut feeling is that some of these technologies are going to turn up in the "N-Gage 2".

[cdover]

Well Nokia was planning to cut the price considerably for the youths. The NGage was infact targeted for young people, so after the 'disaster' of the Ngage, Nokia thought to make it cheaper so that it is more widely available to all.

p.s. Disengage? Haha

[gangstar]

What you guys on about. Its a brilliant ide N-Gage QD. I'm happy with my regular n-gage but I guarantee you guys this'll sell. A 65k or 262k screen would cost as would a camera. Those who want mp3 and radio will just have to buy the original.

Disengage!-LOL:D

[ipodee]

i tink it would do well in the 12-18mkt where people like to play games and can make fone calls,,\ that'd be great

[mindhacker]

A new piece of **** that is worse than the N-Gage.
QD = Ngage + Hotswap MMC + Normal position for calls - MP3 - Radio - Triband...

NGAGE QD SUCKS

[Viipottaja]

Yep, with rebates this will retail at $99 or so, possibly with one or two games thrown in. Some service may subsidize even more.

I think it has a fair change of being a good seller in the 2004 Christmas market, especially in Europe and Asia (with PSP not there yet and with likely higher price point anyway when it comes out).

Tthis is a good business move, and people who want mp3 and radio have the original to choose (and will have to get the bluetooth head set for fear of looking uncool, just like Nokia hoped that everyone would but realized it was not going to happen :) ).

And N-Gage 2 will come and have better features.

The only slight disappointment for me then was no 65k screen, but that would of course have reduced the profit margin per unit sold for Nokia. And they are in this to make money, not to just to satisfy the early adopters.

[Mainframe AI]

i think its a great idea

[shaheen]

great minds think alike, i reckon it wont do too bad, first thing that comes to ppls head is oh, no radio, oh no mp3, but, theyre trying to bring down the price of it, cause they know if they give a better NGage sales of the original NGage will go down, so they kinda have 2 devices under one name, Ngage has mp3 player, blah blah blah and side talking, this has no mp3 player, blah blah blah and no sidetalking, its kinda wat u really need actually, i might get it as a backup phone, lks pretty spiffy;)

[Viipottaja]

All I have to do is try to justify buying it to my girlfriend.. hell, who asks her anyway.. or I could actually buy it to her for her birthday in July.. hey now that's an idea!

The drawback for me personally though is the lack of triband. Hmm.. might have to buy both of them then. :D

[rohanpn]

I saw the new Nokia N-gage QD on the Nokia Website. Here's what I have to say:

Good to see that Nokia's listening to the customers. Some flaws of the original were
fixed like The Hot-swappable MMC/Game card, Side-talking issue was cleared by putting
the speaker in the ventral position (Like the 3300), Nokia is claiming that the screen will
be brighter, the buttons are also fixed in some ways giving one-touch access to game applications.
And not to forget the smaller but thicker dimensions. Battery life has gone better.
By the way, I read that because of the removal of side-talking, there be no more 'tacos' jokes.
Can anybody tell me what are they referring to?

That's for the good part. Now for the bad:
First of all, N-gage QD is dual-band. Dunno why Nokia is going technologically backward, or
maybe they want to come up with an American N-gage QD version (Like the American 3300)
They are dropping off the radio and MP3 player functions to
make the price reasonable. And they've put mono audio support. I can understand why they are
dropping these, I guess to make it more of a game deck. But I don't buy the fact that the MP3
player is dropped because of cost reductions. If one wanted to make a phone (Smart-phone)
MP3 compatible, he'd require 1) A stereo output. and 2) Software to play the music.
Now if at all Nokia did not want to advertise the deck as a music player, fine, don't give the
software. But why the HELL did they remove the Stereo output? It's like taking a step backwards.
People could have put 3rd party software and used it as an mp3 player, now even better because
of the Hot-swappable slot. So it would have been easier to remove the game card and put the MMC
card with music. I heard that Nokia is doing this because it wants to 'increase the shelf life of
the original N-gage'. What freakin' BULLS**T is this. They know that the N-gage has many problems
and still they want to make the customers use it and try to ignore the flaws.
Then, the screen still supports 4096 colors. I guess that Nokia is using the
same display manufactured for the original N-gage by just bumping up the brightness.

Here's what I'd like to see in the next installment (i.e a proper upgrade to the n-gage):

1) 65K color screen would be nice, 262K would be even better.
2) Better graphics processor.
3) Either a VGA or a megapixel camera. As a matter of fact, it would be cool if they put the photo
shutter button on top right side (Next to the headphone/charger port of the N-gage QD) of the deck. Then one would get the similar feeling of holding a digital camera. I am no good at drawing, so use ur imagination.
4) Hot-swappable MMC as well as SD Card slot. MMC is ageing and inclusion of SD will be a strong point.
5) MP3/AAC Music Player with Stereo Output.
6) Infra-red. Yes, many people still use it.
7) Symbian OS 7.0. Hey if they can put it in the 6600 and the 7610, then why not in this one?
8) EDGE. I guess it can be used for high connection speeds while playing multiplayer games.
9) Lithium-polymer battery (like the one used on the P900) for hours of non-stop entertainment.
10) This, i don't know is possible or not, but inclusion of two Stereo loudspeakers on two sides would be sooo coool. I heard that motorola has come up with a phone with stereo speakers. It would be great to listen to music with friends.

[Mainframe AI]

as we both say on mobile-review/forums

Re: My views on the N-gage QD

... But I don't buy the fact that the MP3
player is dropped because of cost reductions. If one wanted to make a phone (Smart-phone)
MP3 compatible, he'd require 1) A stereo output. and 2) Software to play the music.
Now if at all Nokia did not want to advertise the deck as a music player, fine, don't give the
software. But why the HELL did they remove the Stereo output? It's like taking a step backwards.
People could have put 3rd party software and used it as an mp3 player, now even better because
of the Hot-swappable slot. So it would have been easier to remove the game card and put the MMC
card with music. I heard that Nokia is doing this because it wants to 'increase the shelf life of
the original N-gage'. What freakin' BULLS**T is this. They know that the N-gage has many problems
and still they want to make the customers use it and try to ignore the flaws.



you have been fairly speculative and i had expected you to understand this...


the main reason:

n-gage failed. it targetted youths, but mainly because for its too-expensive price, youths would rather get a game-boy and a cheapy phone. most youths didn't see the fact n-gage isn't just a gaming device, and it can play mp3 and radio as well. Why? because intense advertising kept emphasizing on gaming, and common streetspeople/consumers who aren't phone-frenzy like us only knew the ngage as a phone that can play games.


"why is a gameplaying phone so expensive? no, i won't buy it"

as opposed to this now, the QD
nokia wants to truly minimalise this to a gaming phone, and stereo output, screen upgrades, radio hardware etc all cost quite some money. so if they can cut that out the cost will really drop, in where it is more attractive to customers.

"ahh, a gameplaying phone at a reasonable price! sure i'll buy it!"

the second reason

"why was n-gage 1 so much more expensive? let's look into it... OHH it has an mp3 player! and radio! that's why... man i'm gonna buy it!"

yeah kinda stuffy, but that's the second reason, "'increase the shelf life of
the original N-gage'"

sounds stupid, but its all marketting

[rohanpn]

Mainframe AI:

Although I am able to understand your point about Nokia's (realistically Stupid) marketing strategy, it wouldn't have hurt to put Stereo output. As I mentioned earlier, I think it was ok to lay off the radio. Firstly, I guess putting stereo output than mono would not cost more than ~ $ 3 to 5 (My assumption) and Nokia would not advertise the deck to be used as an MP3 player (according to their marketing strategy) but put it later on the 'Things that you did not know you can do with ur Nokia N-gage QD' section of their website. This will make youngsters realize the fact and will make them to go out in Nokia Retail shops to buy a pair of Stereo Headsets and MMC cards. Nokia could make more money.

And, by putting Stereo output, it would make convergence-device-technophiles-geeks like me really happy. :D

I guess if N-gage QD had radio and Stereo MP3, I think more than half of the (tired and stressed) N-gage users would upgrade.
Let me clear that I am not an n-gage hater. I love the idea and loved using it, but it's flaws are too bad to be ignored.

[DEViANT]

I wonder how much they will actually cut the price of the N-Gage QD against the N-Gage. Nokia are still installing Symbian OS and all the tech to go with it (= 104Mhz CPU, TFT display, etc.) which means it can't be all that cheap, unless Nokia are subsidizing it (a stupid move if that's correct). Bet you the only reason battery life is longer is because the MP3 player and radio have gone. And it also appears to have lost vibrating alerts:

* IHF speaker for game sounds plus vibrating game effects

Sounds like (as on the Sony J5) the speaker is the vibrator perhaps. Maybe I'm wrong, but this isn't the major hit phone I was hoping for.

Well, we shall see, I guess it's a step in the right direction, at least progress (in some direction) is being made. I still think the N-Gage on Symbian OS wasn't such a great idea really, you are selling a powerful smartphone with proper OS to the teenage generation and apart from the few teched-up individuals (myself included) I think it's an awful waste, because the great features of customisation and software available are going to waste (how many 'normal' 12-15 year olds are going to be installing applications on it!).

[manav]

Nokia is very smart, It never does anything without thinking what would be the future effects. We might feel what they did was wrong but there is a reason behind all this. I dont know what but there definately is.

I liked its design and all and would be really happy If they released the v2.0.

I like the taco talking isnt it cool. Something different and cool apart from other phones much like the v.60.

Anyways 99$ is really cool you can keep it as a backup phone.

Many opinions but mostly are just like those written above so wont go into them.

Sorry deviant you have been waiting for so long I think you have to wait some more.

(Just aquired a 3660, and 7200);)

Love, Noniee

[Viipottaja]

They say in their own press release:

"The planned range of prices is expected to be from €99/$99 with a contract to €199/$199 as an unsubsidized, untaxed retail price. "

This is one third of the N-Gage price. It is a significant price drop.

Also, battery life is up, I suspect, because the battery is different: BL-6C Li-Ion instead of BL-5C Li-Ion and not so much because mp3 and radio were left out. I guess that may also be why the thing weighs a bit more than the original.

And don't really see why cross-subsidizing N-Gage/N-Gage QD _to some extent_ would be so stupid. Manufacturers do that kind of thing often. Heck, if you look at the profit margins per unit of some manufacturers (lower than standard Nokia margins), you could say they are "subsiding" their whole line of products. Sure, too much cross-subsidation is stupid in the long run unless you can gain market share and then gradually increase your profit margins. This is what investors in your company care about too.

[DEViANT]

Subsidizing is a bad move because if they are intending to make money from the games then they are completely cracked and most people run those. Main reasons are probably the card-swapping, easy availability and the lack of demos to try the game out. I was more talking about if Nokia are selling these at a loss (it's been done in the past...) because a Symbian OS device isn't cheap on hardware that's for sure.

I was being sarcastic about the battery, I was pretty sure it was different. And probably why the QD is thicker as well. At $199 USD though, this device isn't so cheap. That's over £100 and for that money you can get a new Orange UK N-Gage (original) with Fifa 2004 and PAYG sim. Anyway I've spent lots on accessories for my N-Gage (memory cards, case, desktop charger, battery) so I'm keeping it, in spite of its original flaws.

Anyway, Mobileburn's review/snapshot is the most comprehensive yet and explains a lot, a cool feature would be a side-by-side comparison once the device is released.

Anyway, here's to waiting for N-Gage 2! [Hopefully this won't cost too much either as most people aren't going to fork out loads for any N-Gage product]

[Viipottaja]

So the subsidized should be closer to $99.
Unsubsized N-Gage 1 price $299

[Mainframe AI]

Originally posted by rohanpn
Mainframe AI:

...Although I am able to understand your point about Nokia's (realistically Stupid) marketing strategy...

realistically stupid in our views... but probably very smart. Besides, i don't think its an upgrade for existing users... i think it targets newer people

deviant - my friend had a coupla chips for his ngage but most of the games on his phone were downloaded as symbian games. space imact evolution, etc. what, is that screen gonna use java? though there is hardly any multitasking anymore... without radio/music available

[rohanpn]

After a loooot of going through everybody's ideology about the n-gage QD, I now believe that n-gage QD is a good step in reaching out to the 'normal' community but a little disappointing to the 'technophile' community.

[jolo]

My hope is that by targeting the low-end of the spectrum, more N-Gages will be sold, so that then more developers will make better & better games ...

[ardubian]

Just regarding the MP3 player on new NGAGE.
NBC Europe runs a programme called Giga, and it's dedicated to games, computers, mobile technology etc. Anyway, yesterday they reviewed the new Ngage, and they had a guy from Nokia answering questions.
Point is they took out default MP3 player that was included in the old version of the Ngage, but it still allows you to play MP3's.
You just download MP3 codec, and there you go. The Ngage they used in studio had this codec on it, and they just swapped the gaming MMC with 512 MB MMC full of MP3's and it worked perfectly fine.
Tone is mono though. Reason why they got rid of the MP3 and radio, and why there is no camera is to make this new version smaller (which it is by 20%). They still left it open for customers to personalise it (MP3 codec being one of the possibilities).
I think its a fair deal. Not everyone wants/needs MP3 player on their mobiles, and for those that want it, well, just download the damn codec.

[DEViANT]

MP3 and radio take up almost no space (in fact MP3 probably no space at all because the CPU does the work).

You try and make 'downloading the damn codec' so easy but you haven't every tried to explain how you do it. I'm not so bothered about the loss of the MP3 player as to more the mono sound output which seems silly, as with the 6600 and 3650. The radio I have started using a lot on my N-Gage now, it's actually a very understated function and also very useful.

If I could trade my N-Gage for something it would be a Symbian powered clamshell/slider phone with the same features. I think it would be damn cool if Nokia built an N-Gage around the SE Z600 + gamepad style of phone which is clamshell and has the clip-on keypad around the sides.

[Mainframe AI]

they do take up space AND money

[DEViANT]

Originally posted by Mainframe AI
they do take up space AND money

What does the MP3 take up in space (except perhaps a stereo DAC) and the radio is probably a small chip as well. In the millions Nokia are buying these parts in, they probably cost less than £1 for those two parts, so in my mind it's not really an excuse. The QD is smaller perhaps, but it's also fatter, I'm sure there is space in there, there's currently a lot of wasted space in the original N-Gage 1 as well. My point is I'm not getting a QD anyway, except perhaps to try it out and sell again later, but to be honest I do use the N-Gage for music and radio more than games (though the radio can be run at the same time so that's a nice feature).

***

EDIT: I just realised actually the N-Gage appears to have a dedicated MP3 unit onboard because when playing games and the like (with MP3 or radio on) there is no slowdown (which would be the result of using the CPU to do it), so ok perhaps it is a separate part, but I doubt it's a huge one. I also suspect the stereo sound is generated by these dedicated music parts as well, and not the actual OS or unit, which is why removing it gives mono sound - it would explain a lot. Anyway, I suppose it's best not to condemn the unit until I've seen it in person and played with it.

[Mainframe AI]

well they'd have their reason. It probably takes money and space. If not, then its as i said before. It increases the shelf life of the original Ngage, as buyers realise its potential.

If it really doesn't cost anything then tell me why the original ngage costed quite some more money to buy?

[DEViANT]

Originally posted by Mainframe AI
well they'd have their reason. It probably takes money and space. If not, then its as i said before. It increases the shelf life of the original Ngage, as buyers realise its potential.

If it really doesn't cost anything then tell me why the original ngage costed quite some more money to buy?

It costs money because the Symbian platform is generally expensive to build a phone on. You have high-performance CPUs and large, high-res TFT displays to run and in contrast an MP3-decoder and radio are comparatively cheap parts. That is my reasoning. Anyway the N-Gage 1 is £100 now with Fifa 2004 (which is dirt cheap for what you get) included so I fail to see how much cheaper QD can be in the UK, unless they are knocking up the price of N-Gage 1 again (which would be disastrous). If QD is too cheap, it will kill phones like the 3100, 2100, etc. 3100 costs £100 as well at the moment. It's a tough game they're going to play, and I guess rather than arguing about it, it's best to see how Nokia play their cards - all will be apparent in the next few weeks.

[Sid]

Nokia would probably also have to pay a MP3 licensing fee for each N-Gage, which is apparently quite a bit.

[DEViANT]

Originally posted by Sid
Nokia would probably also have to pay a MP3 licensing fee for each N-Gage, which is apparently quite a bit.

Hmm, yeah, forgot about that. We'll an AAC-only (assuming no licensing there) version would suit me, as would an open-source codec so long as the transcoding was pretty simple.

[Mainframe AI]

Originally posted by DEViANT
Hmm, yeah, forgot about that. We'll an AAC-only (assuming no licensing there) version would suit me, as would an open-source codec so long as the transcoding was pretty simple.

though you gotta admit, aac player on a sign as opposed to mp3 player on a sign - i'd say most people who walk by won't even know what aac is

[DEViANT]

Yeah, that's true, but just market it as a 'Music Player' like the ill-fated 5510 and it should be ok (people will notice 'it plays music')! [Though it would need decent software for conversion unlike the 5510 and not be shaped like a brick]

[gangstar]

yeah, i bought my n-gage for 100 quid <- a real bargain. It came with flo boarding on a 32mb card and I bought a 64mb card off ebay. I use the 64mb for my 25 or so aac's and have a few n-gage games on my other card (which I got as gifts!). I use my mp3 player alot and also my radio while playing the games. But what I dont understand is, if i'm using one thing on the memory card why cant i use it for something else???

[DEViANT]

The OS just locks the memory card if it's in use I think. But in light of the dedicated MP3 decoder I think it's because the MP3 decoder has access to the MMC slot re-routed to it away from the main CPU or something like that - yes, a very untechnical explanation. It may just be something as simple as the OS locking it for stability and protected access issues, which frankly, I can live with.

[gangstar]

yeah, the radios fine when playing games.my fave game is fifa 2004. thats brilliant.

In the N-gage, if its ever released, hopefully it will, I'd like a 65k TFT screen, ability to listen to mp3s and play games, VGA camera or free attachment which comes with the phone, IR to use irRemote, EDGE, smaller size and weight (its OK now anyway) and symbian 7.0 and the new series 60 (6600 version which you can put themes in)

BTW, is it possible to use 6600 themes in n-gage with some 3rd party software or something?

[DEViANT]

Yes, this is the major advantage of dedicated MP3/radio hardware, that is doesn't tax the CPU during other tasks (where clearly a third-party software-based solution would). SIS games (as opposed to N-Gage) games installed to the phone are a good way to game and listen to music as well though (I like MagicMine - like the classic game Bejeweled).

Yes, I think the things you mentioned are what everyone else hopes for as well, but on the note of attachable camera, I sooner not have one. I carry a Casio Exilim on me and for the time it takes to attach a camera and fire it up the Casio is already there most of the time (it has 0.9 second startup and I clip it to my belt).

I'm not sure about a third-party software for access to Symbian 7.0 themes but you can get software which modifies the home screens and adds extra functionality which may (or may not) be just as good - I don't use it, the current setup is just nice for me (that said, the 7600 with it's fullscreen 128 x 160 wallpapers that reach under the status bars is a cool feature, the current Symbian setup isn't bad but there is too much white and wasted space!).

[gangstar]

SIS games are brilliant. I have 3 games and 3 apps on my phone memory and about 7 or 8 SIS games on my 64 mb card along with music (so I have games without switching cards, which i admit, is a hassle I could do without) There are also 3D SIS games, I love Rally Pro contest thats so fun and lemonade tycoon. So addictive.